1.) Swamp Fox - 09/26/2017

The search function isn't pulling up our most comprehensive and excellent Rock Climbing Harness thread, even though I know the name of it and that Bluecat started it. So I'm starting this one to post new stuff and also so we can park old material that we want to find easily on a thread that I hope won't get lost by Search in the future.

Post your techniques, questions and ideas about all things related to rock harnesses here if you'd like. Of course, a separate thread will work too, if Search can find it. :re:

:beer:

2.) Swamp Fox - 09/26/2017

BC asked me about adding a lineman's belt to these harnesses, which never have a built-in way to attach them (that I know of). The loops you see on rock harnesses are NOT load-bearing, much less intended for fall protection. You'll see some stuff on the web that guys think the harness below is the exception, but that's not the way I read the manufacturer's description. Just because everything is "full strength" doesn't mean they've planned for you to attach to any old loop or connection and take a fall from it. If I have time, I'll look into it more, but in the meantime be aware of this line of products:

[url]https://www.metoliusclimbing.com/harnesses.html[/url]

Here's a specific model that might be of interest:

[url]https://www.backcountry.com/metolius-safe-tech-all-around-harness?rr=t[/url]


There are a few ways of rigging a lineman's belt to your rock harness depending on what you're attracted to and the type of harness you have.

Here's one idea that will work for the type of harness which has several loops of appropriate strength and placement:



TREEfool


I do something different (not always involving the rock harness) but this is a topic that a lot of people are interested in, so I'll post other ideas along this same line from time to time .

3.) Swamp Fox - 09/26/2017

This is the thread I was looking for above. I guess I started it rather than BC. (But I still couldn't find his "How's It Hanging" threads.)

Unfortunately, the gear photos I posted were on PhotoBucket. I forgot about that. I wonder if I can retrieve them from PB or if they're hostage now?

[url]http://forums.huntingcountry.com/forums/showthread.php?1388-Pro-Tips&highlight=rock+harnesses[/url]



Here's a thread CE started discussing different models of harnesses, and we got into fall descent systems:

[url]http://forums.huntingcountry.com/forums/showthread.php?2017-rock-climbing-harness&highlight=rock+harnesses[/url]


More descent safety systems:

[url]http://forums.huntingcountry.com/forums/showthread.php?2486-Fall-Restraint-Descent-System&highlight=rock+harnesses[/url]

4.) DParker - 09/26/2017

[QUOTE=Swamp Fox;51922]Unfortunately, the gear photos I posted were on PhotoBucket. I forgot about that. I wonder if I can retrieve them from PB or if they're hostage now?[/QUOTE]

You can download them one-by-one, which is a pain (I've been retrieving mine here and there, as time permits)...but you can do it. There's a "Download entire library" function that's supposed to do exactly what that says, but it doesn't work...and according to the innerwebz it hasn't for a while. Given that and their move to all-for-pay I suspect that's intentional.

5.) Swamp Fox - 09/26/2017

LOL ... Thanks for that. This chore went on my to-do list months ago when this issue first came up, but I've never gotten to it.

6.) crookedeye - 10/01/2017

i bought the wingman fall thing, it lowers youre fatass to the ground in case of a fall and reusable..recieved it the other day, video looks pretty good though..

7.) crookedeye - 10/01/2017

....

8.) Dan-o - 10/01/2017

[QUOTE=crookedeye;52039]....[/QUOTE]

Dude! i'm getting that just so I can jump out of mine every time I get in it!!

I might get two, and hang the other one upside down so it can lift me up into the stand!

9.) crookedeye - 10/01/2017

i was thinking of getting a com along..you no one of those rachet just so i could rachete myself up into the stand..then when i;m done hunting i could jump out of the stand and slowly decent to the ground with the wingman..its a totally effortless system..

10.) crookedeye - 10/01/2017

its all about safty..

11.) Swamp Fox - 10/01/2017

[QUOTE=crookedeye;52041]i was thinking of getting a com along..you no one of those rachet just so i could rachete myself up into the stand..then when i;m done hunting i could jump out of the stand and slowly decent to the ground with the wingman..its a totally effortless system..[/QUOTE]

LOL ...

12.) Swamp Fox - 10/01/2017

I wonder if anyone's working on a way to make an Ozonics machine into a jet pack.


[url]http://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2016/10/11/jetpack-aviation-new-jb10-test-flight-orig-vstan-aa.cnn[/url]

13.) bluecat - 10/02/2017

[QUOTE=Swamp Fox;51922]This is the thread I was looking for above. I guess I started it rather than BC. (But I still couldn't find his "How's It Hanging" threads.)

[/QUOTE]

Here are the three threads:

[url]http://forums.huntingcountry.com/forums/showthread.php?1447-How-they-hangin&highlight=hangin[/url]
[url]http://forums.huntingcountry.com/forums/showthread.php?1458-How-they-hanging-part-too[/url]
[url]http://forums.huntingcountry.com/forums/showthread.php?1485-How-they-hangin-part-tree&highlight=hangin[/url]

14.) Swamp Fox - 10/02/2017

:tu:

15.) bluecat - 10/02/2017

[QUOTE=Swamp Fox;51917]BC asked me about adding a lineman's belt to these harnesses, which never have a built-in way to attach them (that I know of). The loops you see on rock harnesses are NOT load-bearing, much less intended for fall protection. You'll see some stuff on the web that guys think the harness below is the exception, but that's not the way I read the manufacturer's description. Just because everything is "full strength" doesn't mean they've planned for you to attach to any old loop or connection and take a fall from it. If I have time, I'll look into it more, but in the meantime be aware of this line of products:

[url]https://www.metoliusclimbing.com/harnesses.html[/url]

Here's a specific model that might be of interest:

[url]https://www.backcountry.com/metolius-safe-tech-all-around-harness?rr=t[/url]


There are a few ways of rigging a lineman's belt to your rock harness depending on what you're attracted to and the type of harness you have.

Here's one idea that will work for the type of harness which has several loops of appropriate strength and placement:



TREEfool


I do something different (not always involving the rock harness) but this is a topic that a lot of people are interested in, so I'll post other ideas along this same line from time to time .[/QUOTE]

Thanks for posting that video Swampy.

16.) Swamp Fox - 10/02/2017

No problemo. Other videos I've seen along these lines over-complicate things or require too much work. This is two simple knots, so I thought it took care of everything very nicely if you have the right kind of harness. Personally, I haven't seen the need to go this route, but if I were to buy a new harness for some reason, or if I were starting from scratch, I might think differently.

BTW, you can get those attachment/rappel rings for five or six bucks each, so they're not a fancy item. They're light and have a ridiculous kN rating. :tu:

17.) bluecat - 10/02/2017

[QUOTE=Swamp Fox;52051]No problemo. Other videos I've seen along these lines over-complicate things or require too much work. This is two simple knots, so I thought this took care of everything very nicely if you have the right kind of harness. Personally, I haven't seen the need to go this route, but if I were to buy a new harness for some reason, or if I were starting from scratch, I might think differently.

BTW, you can get those attachment/rappel rings for five or six bucks each, so they're not a fancy item. They're light and have a ridiculous kN rating. :tu:[/QUOTE]

Can you point me in the right direction. I saw one on REI but it wasn't rated as high. The TreeStuff.com site might have it but I couldn't find it.

18.) Swamp Fox - 10/02/2017

[url]https://www.rei.com/product/799957/smc-riggingdescending-ring?CAWELAID=120217890000792628&CAGPSPN=pla&CAAGID=15877502440&CATCI=pla-282391010776&cm_mmc=PLA_Google|404_33404|7999570018|none|b3286683-95c1-4d00-aac0-be8a4f3131f3|pla-282391010776&lsft=cm_mmc:PLA_Google_LIA|404_33404|7999570018|none|b3286683-95c1-4d00-aac0-be8a4f3131f3|pla-282391010776&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIqITEh-DS1gIVh0SGCh3G7QYVEAQYAiABEgIwAvD_BwE[/url]


32 kN as in the video. I saw some in the store here but didn't look at the rating. Just assumed they were the same thing.

Freakin' REI. You should see me when I go in there to get something that a trail shop SHOULD have... LOL

19.) bluecat - 10/02/2017

Thanks man. Put up my stand on Saturday and rigged up a lineman's belt but this looks like the ticket.

20.) Swamp Fox - 10/02/2017

Here's the same item at TreeStuff:

[url]http://www.treestuff.com/store/catalog.asp?category_id=303&item=1684[/url]


If you go to the main Rings page, you can browse around a lot of other stuff, but I don't see the point for this application (lineman's belt). 32kN is likely the strongest part of your gear by a good margin.

21.) bluecat - 10/02/2017

Should we go ahead and close this thread Swamp? It borders on deer hunting, gear and technique. A definate participation stopper.

22.) JGB Ohio - 10/03/2017

[QUOTE=bluecat;52058]Should we go ahead and close this thread Swamp? It borders on deer hunting, gear and technique. A definate participation stopper.[/QUOTE]

Did somebody rip an eye-burning fart or something? Where did everybody go?

[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFXszIFkiAQ[/url]

23.) Swamp Fox - 10/03/2017

Well, to be fair, this is a niche topic. Not everyone's going to be interested.

Only something like 10% of Americans are avid hunters anyway, forget about using rock harnesses, LOL. I don't know about Canada.

(Really, does anybody know about Canada?)

We need someone to post threads like "The Girls of Bowhunting" and "Weird or Interesting Characters I Met On ArcheryTalk" to really get the discussion flowing.

24.) bluecat - 10/03/2017

Swampy, I need to get some webbing for attaching ladder sticks (repairing old straps) and general use. What do you recommend?

25.) Swamp Fox - 10/03/2017

If you have to go back to REI for anything, they'll sell one-inch webbing by the foot, or at least they used to. Check the store before you make a trip, or try on-line.

As a alternate, this is one site I swing through every once in a while that has a good selection of this and that:

[url]http://www.cascade-rescue.com/categories/rescueropeandwebbing?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIye_DvpDV1gIVilmGCh26wgVoEAMYASAAEgLr0vD_BwE[/url]

26.) Swamp Fox - 10/03/2017

I've also seen some pretty interesting stuff on rigging sticks and ladder sections with rope instead of straps and buckles, so if you're interested in that at all I'll see if I can backtrack.

27.) bluecat - 10/03/2017

rope is fine too but doesn't lend itself (to my knowledge anyway) to those nice spring loaded buckles. Slip through, pull tight, done.

28.) Swamp Fox - 10/03/2017

Yup. A few people are trying to ditch the buckles for weight and noise. I think they just like tying knots. :-)

29.) Swamp Fox - 10/03/2017

[QUOTE=JGB Ohio;52064]Did somebody rip an eye-burning fart or something? Where did everybody go?

[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFXszIFkiAQ[/url][/QUOTE]


Our other member is probably out fighting for truth, justice and the American way in the comments section of every stupidly predictable--and predictably stupid-- anti-gun article on-line for the last two days ...

30.) bluecat - 10/03/2017

+ 2 :-)

31.) Swamp Fox - 10/03/2017

32.) JGB Ohio - 10/04/2017

[QUOTE=Swamp Fox;52072]Our other member is probably out fighting for truth, justice and the American way in the comments section of every stupidly predictable--and predictably stupid-- anti-gun article on-line for the last two days ...[/QUOTE]

Sorry fellas I've been doing just this.

33.) Swamp Fox - 10/04/2017

LOL... Good for you. I don't have the patience or the inner cuddliness to deal with people who don't know what they're talking about, and aren't willing to learn.

34.) bluecat - 10/05/2017

Just ordered two of the rings and some 1" webbing for a harness upgrade. Thanks Swampy.

35.) Swamp Fox - 10/05/2017

Glad to be of service, LOL.

36.) bluecat - 10/05/2017

[QUOTE=Swamp Fox;52076][/QUOTE]

Looks like DP has been hitting the gym.

37.) Swamp Fox - 10/05/2017

With the phone booth scarcity these days, you gotta look good when changing your clothes in public.

38.) Swamp Fox - 10/05/2017

I guess you could find a men's room in a pinch. Gender-neutral if you really had to ...

39.) bluecat - 10/05/2017

With a non-specific gender phone booth how do people figure out which booth is right for them...that day?

40.) bluecat - 10/05/2017

beat me to the punch...

41.) Swamp Fox - 10/05/2017

LOL ...


#superheroproblems

42.) bluecat - 10/05/2017

Having both hands free while you are lifting and putting your stand in place is invaluable. I'm guessing most accidents occur at that juncture.

43.) Swamp Fox - 10/05/2017

I've been using lineman's belts for a long time---so long that I don't remember when I started. But there was a time I used to hang stands without one. Hard to believe I was that stupid ... (No, wait ...) Easier and lower risk with a belt. What's not to like?

I know some people who still set stands with no belt, or sometimes do. I'll never do it anymore. I actually use two lines as a redundancy these days, and I keep one set of gear for hanging stands and another for hunting with, because I don't want to stink up the hunting gear (you should see the sweat and body salt on the hanging gear, LOL) and I also don't want some piece of safety gear in the wrong bag back at camp when I'm at the base of a tree.

My big challenge now is always using a belt just to climb. It slows you down a good bit and is inconvenient and sometimes difficult, but you can't always ensure the three-points-of-contact method, especially with ladder or stick sections. Even if you could, you're liable to fall away from the tree if something breaks, so three points or not you're still screwed.

A lot of accidents (if not the majority) occur stepping into or out of the stand. I don't do that untethered anymore, either, although I used to all the time.

I think I've figured out the best way to handle all these issues and eliminate my excuses. Now it's just a matter of listening to myself and not doing stupid stuff anymore.

44.) bluecat - 10/05/2017

I don't climb into or out of my stand with my backpack or bow. They are always brought up on a line. The backpack when worn throws off one's balance when stepping around on a stand so I don't ever wear it up or down.

45.) DParker - 10/05/2017

[QUOTE=bluecat;52116]Looks like DP has been hitting the gym.[/QUOTE]

I tried that once, but it hit back.

46.) bluecat - 10/05/2017

47.) bluecat - 10/05/2017

48.) Swamp Fox - 10/05/2017

[QUOTE=bluecat;52124]I don't climb into or out of my stand with my backpack or bow. They are always brought up on a line. The backpack when worn throws off one's balance when stepping around on a stand so I don't ever wear it up or down.[/QUOTE]

I'm the same way. Big binoculars on your chest will often be in the way of hugging a tree as well, especially one that leans the wrong way. I try to go up and down with the least gear, which usually means multiple haul ropes. The most I've used at one time is three, LOL. There has been a time or two that I considered a fourth. :bang:

The other thing I don't like about stuff on my back while climbing is that if I fall on it, it's a sure recipe for a broken back or spinal injury. I'm about 80% on not climbing with a rifle anymore, and never climb with a treestand or a bow on my back. (I have carried treestands on one shoulder with a strap, but that's usually more trouble than it's worth.)

I have a little climbing emergency kit I make sure stays with me, but otherwise I usually want to climb the tree with the least gear possible.

49.) bluecat - 10/05/2017

[QUOTE=Swamp Fox;52128]
The other thing I don't like about stuff on my back while climbing is that if I fall on it, it's a sure recipe for a broken back or spinal injury. [/QUOTE]

Another argument against wearing your gear are antlers. Wouldn't want to land on those.

50.) Swamp Fox - 10/05/2017

The rattling antlers I have would be especially dangerous:

51.) bluecat - 10/05/2017

The double helix is particularly nasty.

52.) Swamp Fox - 10/05/2017

I'll bet going in is the easy part with those, LOL

:omg:

53.) bluecat - 10/05/2017

It only hurts for a short time.

54.) bluecat - 10/24/2017

Here's a pic of the rings and their attachment. Basically it is just 1 inch webbing that is tied to the rings with a water knot and the loop formed is slipped on harness belt.

55.) bluecat - 10/24/2017

Sorry for the cluster. You should try putting one of these on in the dark. Hell, even in the light for that matter. My biggest complaint about this harness, is putting it on. Half the time it is inside out (like the pic) and you don't realize it.

56.) bluecat - 10/24/2017

But once it is on, it does offer complete freedom of movement and the knowledge that if I go, I'm not going to hang like a side of beef over the side of my 8 foot high deer stand...

57.) Swamp Fox - 10/24/2017

LOL --

I don't have the inside-out problem, but I think you have a lot of stuff going on there.

I think I see some type of loop runner in there, which I'd like to know how you use, and then there's a strap keeper on something, and a sliding strap handle on a length of webbing (?) that I have no idea about (maybe your tree strap?).

You got a lot of 'splainin' to do, Lucy!

At first I thought I saw homemade shoulder straps in there. I don't think they're necessary, but as long as we're on the topic, there are some rock harnesses that allow one to attach a shoulder-and-chest piece. Some people are freaked out not having a belt *and* suspenders, so if that's the thing holding someone back from trying a rock harness, there you go.

My impression is that they clip in to the waist harness after you put it on, but I could be wrong. If I'm right, though, it might make putting the harness on easier. Again, I don't have that issue, but my harness might be a little stiffer and more easily sorted inside from outside.

Worse comes to worst, BC, you could always take a Sharpie and write I and O on your harness like you know some people should on their underwear ... LOL

And last question (for now, LOL): I didn't think your harness opened in the front to slip the ring loops on. I thought it was a step-in harness.

For a step-in harness, one could have the ring webbing water-knotted to the belt of the harness after first running it thru or girth-hitching it (for some reason) to the ring. Or girth-hitch the ring on a loop and then girth-hitch to the waist belt, which was (basically) my initial set-up. Several different ways to skin the cat. Does yours stay in place on the belt while in use, or does it slide? I would think it slides. My initial system, which I have gotten away from, allowed too much sliding if I wanted my lineman's belt attachments at my hips instead of in front of them.

I'm just throwing out ideas here. Beyond the sliding issue, I'm not fully comfortable attaching to the waist belt when I have other options (including redundancy), but I also can't see how the waist belt is any kind of weak link in the system. The waist belt kinda IS the system. LOL

But if someone would like to throw their two cents in here on that, it could be useful.

58.) bluecat - 10/24/2017

Tell you what. I'll take a better picture and you can go through the whole spiel again. I may be missing something.

My harness can open up the front if I want to. As it is, I just loosen it and tighten it but I can completely undo the belt if I want. That allowed me to slip those loops on. I have another harness that I did write inside on it with a Sharpie. That really helped. I should probably do it here too.

Better picture coming soon. Stay tuned.

59.) Swamp Fox - 10/24/2017

LOL ...

I've got you now on the loops. That was a minor point, LOL. Seemed important at that stage of coffee consumption. Interested to get into the rest of it. :-):wink

60.) bluecat - 10/24/2017

"Rose goes in the front, big guy."

61.) Swamp Fox - 10/24/2017

:p

+3